Toyota Announces New All-Electric SUV, Says It's Their 'First Step' For Battery-Electric Cars (electrek.co) 104
Toyota announced today that they will be unveiling a new all-electric SUV in the coming months. Electrek reports: The automaker, which has been seen as a lagger when it comes to all-electric vehicles, says that it's their 'first step' for battery-electric vehicles. Toyota has yet to launch an all-electric vehicle outside of China. Toyota announced a new midsize electric SUV today: "Toyota announced today that it will preview a brand-new model for its European Battery Electric line-up -- a mid-sized battery-electric SUV based on the forthcoming the e-TNGA platform."
For now, they are only showing the silhouette (pictured above), but the automaker says that more details are coming in the next few months. The un-named preview model will be based on Toyota's new e-TNGA platform. Thanks to its clever design the new platform is both highly versatile and easily adaptable for a range of product types. They unveiled this image with the announcement -- showing a dual motor all-wheel-drive powertrain and modular battery pack. The automaker confirmed that the vehicle is already being readied for production.
For now, they are only showing the silhouette (pictured above), but the automaker says that more details are coming in the next few months. The un-named preview model will be based on Toyota's new e-TNGA platform. Thanks to its clever design the new platform is both highly versatile and easily adaptable for a range of product types. They unveiled this image with the announcement -- showing a dual motor all-wheel-drive powertrain and modular battery pack. The automaker confirmed that the vehicle is already being readied for production.
Based on Tesla's market cap (Score:3, Funny)
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no, overpriced status toys designed by weird beanie propeller heads without common sense won't be able to compete against electric cars mass produced by major automakers that know how to make cars.
Really, the "design" of Tesla's non-electrical parts could be compiled into a joke book for manufacturing engineers.
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Re: Based on Tesla's market cap (Score:2)
Maybe a better comparison is the Nokia phones. At one time the 5110 dominated the gsm market. Eventually something more useful, albeit enslaving, came along.
Re: Based on Tesla's market cap (Score:5, Insightful)
Honestly, Toyota is more like the Nokia here. Telsa released the iPhone a couple of years ago, and Toyota is just now launching its Android phone.
The switch to EVs is inevitable, and Toyota's bet on fuel cells seems to have been overtaken by advances in batteries which are here, good enough, and getting cheaper all the time. Soon there will be lots of competition for Tesla but right now, only VW seems to be going all in. Maybe the rest will have time to catch up, we'll see.
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what needs to happen is the US needs to step in and create a universal standard for battery modules. Just like when your grill needs more propane, you simply go somewhere and do an exchange. If the power cells could be swapped out rapidly, it would solve a lot of the hangups with EVs, especially for travel. I am not against EVs, but currently their utility is limited to a 100miles of your residence. Nobody wants to sit at a charging station for hours at a time when taking a trip. There are some jobs in sale
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I don't see that happening. If you live with an EV, especially one with 200+ miles of range (which is a lot of them now) you'll see that the vast majority of the time you're charging at home, overnight, and it's just not an issue. I expect that in the US we'll end up with 300+ miles of range being the base, once the price of batteries drops some more. For road trips, even a long trip in a slow charging EV like a Leaf today only adds a couple of hours; most new EVs are already way better than that, and it wi
Re: Based on Tesla's market cap (Score:2)
I drive more than 200 miles a day when not in lockdown. I drive 600-800 miles per day when on vacation. Thats just not practical without swapping out power.
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Late reply but... Look at abetterrouteplanner.com and you'll see that with many Tesla models, an 800 mile trip is totally feasible in a day. At 200 miles a day an EV should make more sense for you if you have reasonably cheap electricity, since you should save on both fuel and service costs.
Just the US? (Score:2)
Just in the US? That would cover what, maybe 25% of their stock price today. They're going to need Europe too, and a good chunk of China. It's a good thing China doesn't already have two or three EV manufacturers bigger than Tesla, companies like BYD.
Eh, BYD only makes about a dozen EV models. I'm sure China will be happy to shut down and hand the market over to an American.
Re: Just the US? (Score:2)
Just curious, but does the BYD vehicles breakdown suddenly after a couple years and force you to throw it in a landfill and just replace it with another? Or is there serviceability designed into it?
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I've now owned one, but because it's Chinese we can reason that it's probably designed with the exact of serviceability and durability that makes economic sense. I'll explain what I mean.
Project Farm tested a couple of impact drivers - a premium US brand and a Chinese knock-off. The handle of the Chinese brand broke when it was dropped ten feet onto concrete but the tool still worked; the American brand did not break. The US brand cost 10X as much.
Some commenters said "see, you should buy the US b
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unfortunately when you factor in carbon footprint of manufacture and recycling, as well as the potential waste of landfill space consumed, I would rather have something that does not break than have to have spares on standby and waste energy to smelt that tool back down to re-forge again later. I am surprised that tool exist BTW. Snap-On is now made by the same shitty chinese company that makes Harbor Freight, Craftsman, and Cobalt tools. They all have a lifetime warranty, which really means buy once, repla
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>Toyota does not have a snowball's chance in hell of succeeding. Within 5 years, all vehicles sold in the US will be Teslas.
You can blame the government for that. If they had mandated a common fast charging standard early on, like most of the rest of the world, other manufacturers would be in a better position to compete. As it is, Tesla have the only charging network that is effective in the USA for long distance trips and it will take several years for any other vendor to install anything equivalent, e
Re: Based on Tesla's market cap (Score:2)
IMO, this has always been the downfall in the US. Competing to be âthe standardâ(TM) causes economic politics to play out in such a way that the better technology does not always win. Its about forcing people to pay royalties for your standard. Betamax vs VHS, HD-DVD vs BluRay, etc. those were about the encoding (codecs) used and which studios got royalties as well as cheaper production costs.
If we would actually set forth standards and level the playing field early on the better technology would
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Aren't the other manufacturers interested? In Europe Nissan/Renault built the first charging networks, and now as well as several independents there is a big one backed by several manufacturers.
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Aren't the other manufacturers interested? In Europe Nissan/Renault built the first charging networks, and now as well as several independents there is a big one backed by several manufacturers.
Yes. I was referring to the USA, where the non Tesla charging stations are few in number and have different connectors (CCS, ChaDeMo, etc).
In Europe there are far more charging stations that work for all electric cars, because they have a common CCS based fast charging interface.
Re: Based on Tesla's market cap (Score:2)
The biggest drawback is going to be the high cost of installing a charging station in your home. Without it, using the standard 110v NEMA 5-15 outlet, charges at a rather shitty 2 miles per hour charge rate. If you charge it half the day your commute better be ~ 10 miles each way. Homes built before the 40s only had 100 amp service wired to them. My house, built in 2002, only has 200amp service at 100amp per leg. Residential housing does not get 3-phase 400v service which is the most efficient way to delive
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if they would just make the batteries into modular pluggable form factors you could just swap them out like you do propane canisters and be done with the whole problem entirely. I just pulled the installation manual for the gen3 wall charger for tesla. That one requires a double pole 60A breaker @ 240v for a 48A charge rate. I havent looked up the requirement for a nissan leaf charging station. What I am suspicious of is can the grid handle every single car on the street drawing 48A overnight. If you factor
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The biggest drawback is going to be the high cost of installing a charging station in your home. Without it, using the standard 110v NEMA 5-15 outlet, charges at a rather shitty 2 miles per hour charge rate. If you charge it half the day your commute better be ~ 10 miles each way. Homes built before the 40s only had 100 amp service wired to them. My house, built in 2002, only has 200amp service at 100amp per leg. Residential housing does not get 3-phase 400v service which is the most efficient way to deliver that much power. Its also why I am stuck with a tank water heater instead of tankless on-demand. Every manual I downloaded on the variety of products say you need 300amp service.
The cost of charging station installation is pretty minimal. It's $100 to get the permit and inspection from the city, $300-$400 for the electrician, and $350-$500 for the charger. The service into my house is 240V. My panel is 125 A and 50 A is used for the charger's line. Charging rate is 30 miles/hr on the mobile charger. It would be about 40 miles/hr if I got hardwired wall charger. We've never exceeded 250 miles on any single day of driving so an 8-hour charge is fine for us. You don't even need a g
Toyota has yet to launch an all-electric vehicle? (Score:5, Interesting)
Toyota has yet to launch an all-electric vehicle outside of China.
Odd. I could have sworn I test-drove a RAV4 EV in Northern California before I bought my Model X. I had no idea that China claimed Sunnyvale as part of its territory. :-D
Of course, I concluded that its range couldn't handle my average daily commute once you factored in the elevation change, and they never improved it to have a range that was actually usable, but it was a BEV, and it was launched in at least part of the U.S.
Re:Toyota has yet to launch an all-electric vehicl (Score:5, Informative)
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RAV4 EV was long discontinued by the time Model X came out. RAV4 EV was a limited production (not available in all states) using Tesla Roadster technology, which is 2 generations of Tesla cars behind the Model X. Toyota then bet on Hydrogen as the future of cars, rather than BEV. Seems they are coming around, or at least hedging their bets.
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RAV4 EV was long discontinued by the time Model X came out.
You'll notice I said "before", but not how long before. :-) To be honest, I didn't realize it was quite as long before as it actually was, but yes.
The time frame does overlap, but only because Tesla announces cars long before they actually start selling them. The Model X didn't come out until 2015, but it was announced in February of 2012. By the time I test-drove the RAV4 EV in... I think mid-2012, I was well aware that Tesla was going to sell a crossover/SUV with a usable range.
The combination of inade
What is its tow rating? (Score:2)
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a sketch can't tow much. talk about vaporware....
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What if the camper is also a sketch? /M. Night Shyamalan
Re: What is its tow rating? (Score:1)
Re: What is its tow rating? (Score:2)
Electric motors have higher torque ratings than gas engines. For the same HP diesel out torques gas engines significantly. However you will also need better stopping capabilities in order to solve both aspects of towing ratings.
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In this context, I think it's safe to say that SUV means "slightly taller car". This is not going to be an electric 4 Runner.
Is this a joke? (Score:3)
Check out their "this image", it's napkin drawing.
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They are not the company they used to be. The finally recovered from over engineering to cut costs to the bone but kill reliability but they are still slow and locked into stealing other people's ideas and pretending those ideas are theirs long after they have come out, as they play catch up.
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When were Toyotas not reliable?
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Toyotas have always been reliable. The plethora of electronic gadgets have made ALL cars less reliable but Toyota is still the best overall, year after year. I've got an old Tundra with over 250,000 miles and it runs like a Swiss watch. Everything works like new. Never had a single electronic issue or mechanical issue. Basic routine maintenance is all she has ever needed and I expect it will still be running with 500K on the clock.
Being that electric cars are far simpler that gas cars I expect the quality t
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The images look like someone beat on a Jaguar iPace with an ugly stick.
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That can only improve its looks.
"This Image" very important (Score:1)
Check out their "this image",
You can tell that diagram was crucial to success in delivering a car, because something was broke before but now it is "FIXED".
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Shit, I pay good money to have somebody draw my design on a napkin. All you have to do is email them the CAD designs, and they email back the napkin photos. It costs extra if you want the actual napkin mailed to you, so that you can bring it to meetings.
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It's also not a SUV, it's a CUV. You can see that clearly from the diagrams [electrive.com] of e-TNGA.
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Steps (Score:3)
How many "steps" did Tesla need? These established car companies are finding it harder than a company someone starts from scratch. None of the established car companies have the staff or focus to even make a hello world program let alone mimic all the cool software features in a Tesla. They STILL don't get what makes Tesla cool. A Tesla is not an electrified version of a gasoline car. It has tons of software features that make it cool, such as the possibility of self driving in many situations. A toyota's sensor coverage is weak. A tesla has 8 cameras, 12 ultrasonic sensors, and radar surrounding it.
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The roof thing happened one time .. of course given the well funded Tesla haters it gets broadcast everywhere. God knows the established car companies have their own issues too .. you know how many recalls GM, Ford, and Toyota have had? Plenty.
You wouldn't know this, but it's a FACT that 40,000 people die every year just in the USA in car accidents .. yet not one non-Tesla accident is ever put on the news. Why is that? idiots like you spread the myth that Toyota doesn't have any car accidents or defects. Th
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I get that Tesla customers are happy, they have the latest tech, it stands out, it is cool, it's the new thing. But don't try to make it that Tesla quality is 'Job One'. Their goal is disruption, sure that has worked. But as a car company? Let's see where they are in 10 years after the shine has worn off.
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"The roof thing happened one time .. of course given the well funded Tesla haters it gets broadcast everywhere. "
Indeed, a manufacturing problem so severe and egregious that it could ONLY happen to Tesla, and has never happened to any other manufacturer, is the fault of "well funded Tesla haters".
Increasing your lead as the most ignorant poster on /.
'yet not one non-Tesla accident is ever put on the news. Why is that? idiots like you spread the myth that Toyota doesn't have any car accidents or defects. The
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As difficult as it may be to believe, not everyone wants that crap in a car. The more complicated you make something, the more likely it is to break and the more expensive it is to fix.
Considering all the problems Tesla is already having with fit, finish and reliability issues [cnn.com], not to mention flash modules dying years before their expected life [slashdot.org], perhaps shoveling shit into a box shouldn't be the highest priority.
Re:Steps (Score:5, Interesting)
You may think that's what makes a Tesla cool, but if they were to come out with a low-cost, "regular" electric car (i.e. no self-driving) that has a stereo with Apple Car Play, a rear view camera, A/C and heating, i.e. stuff you find in any other car, I'd buy that immediately. The less automated, so-called A.I. crap, the better.
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You may think that's what makes a Tesla cool, but if they were to come out with a low-cost, "regular" electric car (i.e. no self-driving) that has a stereo with Apple Car Play, a rear view camera, A/C and heating, i.e. stuff you find in any other car, I'd buy that immediately. The less automated, so-called A.I. crap, the better.
There is a lot of cars delivering that already - Hyundai EVs are really nice and low cost, Kia Niro and VWs e-Golf / ID.3 as well. Note that in the world's most developed EV market - Norway - Tesla is no longer the bestselling EV brand or model. Several EV models are sold in larger numbers than Tesla's best selling model, the Model 3.
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Out of interest have you bought one of the many other EVs that has Apple Car Play, a rear view camera, A/C and heating?
If not, what is holding you back?
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The price the other companies are asking for are way over the average price of an ICE vehicle. They always blame the cost of the batteries and that's why Tesla can have a lower price on their future entry-level car: their own battery factories with faster manufacturing times and thus a lower cost. Tesla also manages both summer and winter temperatures for their batteries, something Nissan messed up. That's why the Nissan Leaf is not as popular as it should be in Canada.
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I don't have a Tesla, but I do have a Leaf, and I would speculate that actually, a lot of what makes a Tesla cool is what makes any EV cool - the electric drivetrain. It's just so much nicer to have an almost silent, responsive motor than an internal combustion engine. Sure, the bells and whistles make Tesla stand out from my Leaf, but even my Leaf is much nicer to drive than almost any gas powered car. When I got the Leaf I had a BMW convertible, which I sold after having to repeatedly jump start since it
Re: Steps (Score:1)
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What are you talking about? Gasoline cars are full of all kinds of problems.
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Remember this post the next time you're changing your oil, gearbox fluids, oil filter, fuel filter, brake pads, drive belts, spark plugs, coil packs, water pump, fuel pump, etc. while anyone in an EV isn't doing any of that except for brake pads, like once every 100k miles and a coolant / brake fluid flush every 2 or 4 years or so. And that's not saying anything about if you have actual mechanical service because complex mechanical parts that don't exist on most EVs break or wear with usage.
And oh no I can
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I forgot where Chrysler all of a sudden makes minivans that don't ever break and don't require maintenance at regular intervals. Wrong. [chryclub.com]
Meanwhile, here [tesla.com] is Tesla's maintenance schedule:
Cabin Air Filter
Your Tesla is equipped with an air filter that prevents pollen, industrial fallout, road dust and other particles from entering through the vents. Tesla recommends replacing your cabin air filter every 2 years.
High Efficiency Particulate Air (HEPA) Filter
If your Tesla is equipped with a HEPA filter, Tesla recommends replacing it every 3 years.
Tire Rotation, Balance and Wheel Alignment
Tesla recommends rotating your tires every 6,250 miles or if tread depth difference is 2/32 in or greater, whichever comes first. Aggressive driving can lead to premature tire wear and may require more frequent tire service. Unbalanced and misaligned wheels affect handling, tire life and steering components. Refer to tire manufacturer's owner manuals and warranty documentation for additional details.
Brake Fluid Test
Tesla recommends testing brake fluid for contamination every 2 years and replacing as needed.
Air Conditioning Service
An air conditioning service replaces the desiccant to help the longevity and efficiency of the air conditioning system. Tesla recommends an air conditioning service every 2 years for Model S, every 4 years for Model X and Model Y and every 6 years for Model 3.
Winter Care
Tesla recommends cleaning and lubricating all brake calipers every 12 months or 12,500 mi for cars in cold weather regions.
Even brake pads last 100k miles because you barely touch them.
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If it's not about daily driving needs, why post criticism that is only relevant to daily driving needs?
Having a "full tank" is only necessary to reduce the number of trips to refill, which is utterly irrelevant with an EV that charges overnight. Unless you are driving an amount of miles larger than the capacity of the battery, and even then, you don't need to go to 100% capacity if there is sufficient high speed charging available on your route.
I drove from Ohio to Oregon and back with trips to Eastern Ore
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What is "taking chances" about "I need to drive 80 miles today total, and every day I wake up my battery has 250 miles of range in it" ?
Seems like you are being intentionally obtuse.
Re: Steps (Score:1)
Did we really not learn the difference between average demand and peak demand this year?
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Why do you think that an EV can't drive 450 miles in a day?
This year I've driven far more than that in a day, in an EV, for multiple days.
Maybe less condescension, and more information.
Re: Steps (Score:1)
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The thing you're forgetting is that all EV owners either have many years experience driving ICE vehicles or they still own a second vehicle that runs on gas (that's my situation). So, how could it be that with all their experience with BOTH vehicles, they have such a positive opinion of EVs and such a negative opinion of gas vehicles?
It's like the old linux vs. windows thing. Windows users almost never have experience with li
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Not much different than horse owners not wanting to sacrifice how they could ride a horse off road, and all those new fangled car drivers have to stick to prepared surfaces. Or how the cars can't jump obstacles or reproduce and make new cars.
I can tell you from personal experience though, the "sacrifices" for me quickly become routine and I realized how many sacrifices I was making by exclusively driving ICE vehicles. As I mentioned, I still have a ga
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Well I do if they obsolete ICEs before they actually work in my climate.
I'm curious about this part. What's your climate like?
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A Rolex isn't cool to people knowledgable about watches, so your analogy is even more accurate than it first appears!
The difference between Tesla and Timex is that Timex invested in learning how to make its products. It's unlikely that Timex ever pulled $100 out of the register and sent an employee to Home Depot for supplies to make its products. Tesla did.
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I can attest to this. I have stood in a room full of car industry execs in Holland Michigan, espousing the benefits of adopting standardized, powerful CPU based platforms for their cars. The response was basically - "What's wrong with the 8051s we use? Anything else would be too expensive". 20 years later, here we are.
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The issue is that it creates massive integration. Instead of having a bunch of smaller processors doing specific, limited tasks, you start to rely on the one big one for everything.
As Tesla owners have discovered this has some downsides to say the least. If that one system fails it takes out everything, including safety critical stuff like the window defogging. You think it's bad with "just replace the whole module" now, wait until it becomes "just replace the entire master control unit".
Now look at the cos
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...and Tesla makes these mistakes because, as a matter of policy from the very beginning, they refuse to learn from the experience of others who've done these same things for decades. It isn't as those the automotive industry never considered alternative approaches.
Fanboys simply refuse to consider that Tesla doesn't understand how to make cars in volume and to be profitable over time. This is a classic example. It will be far harder for Tesla to learn these lessons, considering their arrogance, than it
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"20 years later, here we are."
Here we are what? Are you implying that the automotive industry uses nothing more powerful than an 8051? If so, you can attest to nothing.
Another thing, requirements have evolved somewhat over the last 20 years, though apparently that hasn't occurred to you. More importantly, an 8051 is more than enough to write a "hello world" program, so you've failed to even attest to what was claimed!
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>Here we are what?
Here we are with the poorly integrated systems in cars compared to Tesla's.
While my leaf is nice to drive, the computer is hopeless and buggy. The app integration is useless. The map is a waste of time.
My Ford Transit Connect can't even stand in a garage for a month without draining the battery.
Meanwhile, my Tesla has excellent integration of the computer, comms system and driving system management.
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"None of the established car companies have the staff or focus to even make a hello world program let alone mimic all the cool software features in a Tesla. "
This might be the single most ignorant thing ever posted on /. Amazing considering it didn't come from SuperKendall. We all knew you were a total fool, but supreme fool of /. is quite an accomplishment.
Modern cars, ICE or EV, are essentially rolling computers and have been for decades. Sure, Tesla leads in making fart noises as is, no doubt, your pr
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Lots of people don't care if it has 8 cameras and 12 ultrasonic sensors. They want to travel between points A and B at minimum cost. Which is why they buy Toyotas.
Cells? (Score:2)
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According to Toyota, no. They have said that the platform will transition to solid state in the future.
Not even the US, and not even 2021... (Score:2)
it will preview a brand-new model for its European Battery Electric line-up
So a model that is built to ship only to Europe, which means it will be especially small and probably have very limited range....
But even more important than that, if we are even to just to see details in the next few months - it's not a 2021 model car, possibly not even a 2022 model car?
I'm curious if Toyota is giving up on hydrogen or if this is just an offshoot vehicle from a primary hydrogen line they are working towards.
Hyundai. (Score:2)
Similar concept, better illustrated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?... [youtube.com]
The end of hydrogen? (Score:3)
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The beginning of that particular end was already in the making years ago. Nobody in their right mind was going to build tens of thousands of pressurized hydrogen transfer stations, run thousands of pressurized hydrogen tankers per day to keep them filled up, and build the unbelievable amount of infrastructure necessary to create all that hydrogen to begin with.
As it turns out, hydrogen fuel cells kind of suck for this purpose when we can just have an armored sealed rechargeable battery made from a solid me
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This is all hindsight analysis. Since then there was "diesel gate" and the forced investment in nationwide charging infrastructure. Today, the choice of approach is far more obvious than it was prior.
Not an endorsement of fuel cells, just pointing out that the choice was not as clear cut as you make it, and choosing another approach was not the result of not be in their "right mind". Furthermore, the beginning of this "particular end", i.e. a BEV vehicle, was "already in the making years ago."
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Charging stations have always been a better economic bet regardless of "diesel gate" - mostly because the infrastructure for delivery of electricity already exists, and doesn't need to be "refilled" like any liquid fuel by driving around big tanks of it. Also, hydrogen embrittlement.
Not sure why you're thinking this was just decided like last week or something - the writing has been on the wall for years.
An announcement of an announcement... (Score:2)
So Toyota issued a press release that they're going to show off something months from now. And somehow this is news?
Are other industries taking cues from the smartphone manufacturers now?
Yawn.
Sure (Score:2)
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Sure, just like Toyota was "dragged...kicking and screaming" into the hybrid market. They just need a PayPal grifter to show them how to make cars.
Hybrids, of which Toyota has always been the world leader", contain literally every piece of technology needed to to make a BEV. Toyota learned how to do this before Tesla ever did anything.
The stench of fear is strong among the Tesla fanboys.
Is this all now a moot point? (Score:3)
With work from home looking to become a permanent feature for at least some of the population (myself likely included as permanent WFH), it changes a lot of the dynamics with electric cars.
For instance, range is no longer really an issue if I'm not driving to an office every day. I'll be doing little driving during the week with longer, but most likely well within range, drives on the weekend. For that matter, do I really care how long it takes to recharge the batteries?
I'm seeing a future, at least for me, where I drive a lot less than I used to. With Toyota entering the fray you can be sure that if nothing else they will build a very high quality vehicle. Quality has been something that Tesla has rightfully gotten knocked for. Great technology and very innovative but poor quality vehicles is the general consensus.
At the high end we now have Volvo, VW in the mid range and now Toyota will fall in the sensible/durable/family friendly range. The challenge for Tesla is going to be how to maintain their lead. Having the charging network is a big head start but they have got to find a way to improve their quality and show they can build at scale.
Easy decision (Score:2)
Easy decision for me: I will get my first all electric vehicle when Mazda makes one. "ABT". (Anything but Tesla)
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Mazda has the MX-30, which sort of sucks... I wish they had made an EV MX-5, with a decent enough range, I'd buy it immediately. Instead, they have a small SUV with a sub-124 miles range. In theory 124 miles would be just enough to let me commute to work and back, if there's no problem on the road. A battery larger than 35.5 Kwh would be nice, but not an option.
It costs the exact same price as a Leaf+, which has a 62Kwh battery. It costs more than a Renault Zoe, which comes with a 52Kwh battery.
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Does the MX-30 hybrid flavor work for you?
Toyota EV is "first step?" (Score:1)
The real news? (Score:1)
I heard in passing that they will come with solid state batteries. I.e., don't burn up and last forever. If that's true, that is the best reason to get one.